August 22, 2012 LA Call
When: Wednesday, August 22, 2012
Time: 10:45 Mountain Time
Attendees: Kingsley Rutters (TBRA), Bob Schallhorn (WCA), Buddy Brownstein (MOBRA), Tamara Bessette (MTBRA), Don Russell (MTBRA), Dave Fowkes (ICA), Jack McNeal (BRAO), Keith Creeden (FRCA), John Patterson (GABRA) Loch Miwa (ICA), Darrell Webb (NCA) Judy Rhyne (CCA), Diane Fortini (NEBRA), Randy Legeai (LAMBRA), Greg Aden (SCNCA), Bonnie Walker (TXBRA), Ted Fisher (NCNCA), Kevin Lennon (MCF), Jeff Poulin (NYSBRA), Deb Schiff (NJBA), Joe Holmes(WSBA), and Erik Anderson (WSBA).
Staff: Gordon Weldon, Susie Diller, Valecia Frasier, Larry Martin, Randy Inglis, George Heagerty, Jeffrey Hansen, Beth Vialpando, Jan Luke, Stuart Lamp, and Fred Blattspieler.
If you were present for the call, and I missed your name, please send me an e-mail so that I may add you to the list
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- Update on On-Line Post event form – Heather Rockwood
- Ticketing system is in place- once info is input by CR then ticket goes to RD to pay, and can go back and forth between CR and RD if there are discrepancies
- Once payment is made, ticket is assigned to MSC to close out once paper forms received
- Will go live September 1
- If you would like us to collect LA fees, please let us know- we take 2.5%
- Or, we can simply list the fees and not collect them- just creates invoice for RD to mail payment to LA
- Is it possible to put in a fixed dollar amount instead of a per rider fee? Or a combination of flat fee plus per rider? Not in there now, but we can add it in the future.
- Link to set permissions is on LA Reports page: https://www.usacycling.org/myusac/index.php?pagename=LAPostEventPermissions
- Goal for uptake on online form? 100% in a perfect world…
Paper post-event forms
- We like to receive both the CR report and the post event report in paper form
- To combine them and eliminate redundancies, let us know in the next 30 days exactly what you don’t want/need on there- tricky because LA, officials, and USAC all use those forms for different purposes. So very few things are used by absolutely no one
- Customer Service – Fred Blattspieler
- General reminders
- Race Directors not honoring prize lists:
- How pervasive is this? No reports on the call, but we hear about it 3-4 times a year- some people think it’s a huge issue, others the opposite. What is the best way to enforce this? Is it isolated to a few incidents? Perhaps require RDs to break down prize list by place ahead of time on flyer or website, then officials can hold them accountable.
- One area that we don’t have control is when they post their flyer to their personal website and then can edit it as much as they want after it’s approved. Floating payout schedules based on rider turnout create problems- should at least have a base amount. Some LAs require only PDF flyers, no external links. IF we did that…? Links are good, because only so much info fits on a flyer, but there needs to be the basics on a PDF flyer.
- Officials don’t know if payout is not made unless riders approach us. If fewer than minimums mandated in rulebook show up for race, adjustments can be made
- State Championship Medal order
- How challenging is it to calculate medals? Some LAs had trouble getting enough medals this year. LAMBRA usually has extras because not every podium is full. Only issue is if we add races after order is placed. Cut back to fewer age groups from every five year age group. How do you end up short? New track that doesn’t communicate how many events they’re holding at championships. Medals 3 deep for every track event? Most medals go to track events… Yes
- 2012 LA Summit dates: Friday, November 2nd to Sunday, November 4th
I have received some good suggestions:
CCA - One topic for the summit, though it could be during the open discussion session, would be how to increase the prestige of State Championship events. We find that attendance is not always what it should be at State Championship events, and in some cases, finding a promoter for the event is also a challenge. This was not an issue when State Championships were qualifiers for Nationals, but as soon as that practice stopped, the prestige of the State Championships diminished and riders and promoters lost interest. I would be interested in hearing what other states/LA’s are doing to keep their State Championship attendance up.
- Nationals qualification system using state championships
- NYSBRA gives $500 grant to state champs RDs to make event better- been successful. State champ jerseys has helped (now use Voler through USAC). Also, other RDs get $100 if they advertise that state champions get free entry into race. Finally, a good deal of publicity for those events.
- LAMBRA also added points omnium to state championships
- ICA - a discussion of what LA's can/do/should "require" of races they permit - fixed per rider charges, fixed race charges (e.g. $xxx for camera/results systems), etc.
- ICA - input from USAC management as to what they think the direction should be for LA's in general. The whole "What should our role be?"
- Merits and faults of the Current Permit Fee Structure
- Threshold is the same for years, although prize lists have gone up.
- If top events are paying less, small events are paying more- if D and E races go up from $25, $50, is that a problem? “No, that’s a small cost compared to everything else” How many D/E events? Roughly 80% A events: 64 or so, B, is 80-100, etc
- What about flat fee for every event, regardless of size, etc? If fee is more than $50 for smallest events, you start to see a disincentive for them. Threshold should go up from $499, etc to $999, etc. Problem is also that prize threshold is for single race, instead of total event
- Series are also an issue of revenue for us. Can we increase series fees? Yes, definitely abused- it’s too cheap. What about additional tiers between 4-30 days? Such as 4-10 days, 11-20, etc?
- How can we get those training races permitted? In IL we do permit, but they barely make money because they barely charge anything?
- Define non-competitive: no prizes, or no results? No officials?
- Some series are as big or bigger than weekend events, needs to be revisited.
- What about charging based off of participation? Big events pay more, small events stay cheap?
- Could charge in a per rider surcharge, or a range, so 0-50 riders is $X, 51-150 is $2X, etc. Flat fee up front, and then additional fees once they go past a threshold of riders throughout the series.
- WA: If fees are increased on weekday races, they will no longer sanction with USAC. Weekday races should be gateway to the sport, cheap entry point.
- TX: Weekday races are not training races, they are full on. Limited prize list, but extremely competitive.
- WA: What are we trying to achieve? By increasing costs, we drive people away by pricing ourselves out of the market.
- Gordon: current fee structure is broken, needs to change. But we need to remain revenue neutral so we can maintain services. Currently series drawing in thousands of people over 30 days pay only $50, same as a D event- is that fair? Also, 3 years since we changed insurance surcharges, permit fee hasn’t changed in 10 years, and license fees in 8 years.
- WA: People keep saying fees going up for RDs, not USAC fees, but everything else is getting more expensive. Entry fees for riders have gone up 50% in 10 years.
- Have insurance premiums actually gone up? Yes, but we also can’t change the surcharge every year based on premiums. Also, even when there is a surplus, the money is invested back in the sport. We’re not ‘getting rich’ off of insurance surcharges.
- Services that USAC offers needs to be communicated better to members
- Maybe talk at summit about what USAC does for riders and for LAs to pass along
- Insurance premium based off ridership or permits? Both, flat fee based off last year and potential claims, etc. More claims that come against us, more premiums go up. Also, additional insured certificates, including reissues, each cost us per cert, etc
This Article Published August 22, 2012 For more information contact: